Toploader information.

[Hubcap08]

I decided that I ought to just do one trans swap with nto my 61 when I put the 429 I bought for it in, so I have a few questions regarding toploaders I hope y'all can solve for me. My 429 came with a good low mileage c6, but I want to do away with it in favor of a toploader 4spd. What do I need to look for on one of these transmissions? A local Ford guru told me to come see him one day, he's got 15-20 of em, I just need to know what I need. He told me it would be about 900-1000bucks and he would go thru it and fix anything wornout beforehand. Will a small block one work for a big block? Would a close ratio or wide ratio be better? Long tailshft or short tailshft fits in slick60s?? Which starter am I going to run? Any other advice?

[SLICKCOLLECTOR]

i would use a large in/out toploader. any big block ford came with those. a short or a long tailshaft will work. a 429/460 bellhousing is expensive for a toploader however. any 460/429 starter will work depending on what you use for exhaust. headers or factory 460 exhaust from a later model pickup. depends on your front suspension modification if any. lots of questions to be answered.

jim

[chris401]

i would use a large in/out toploader. any big block ford came with those. a short or a long tailshaft will work. a 429/460 bellhousing is expensive for a toploader however. any 460/429 starter will work depending on what you use for exhaust. headers or factory 460 exhaust from a later model pickup. depends on your front suspension modification if any. lots of questions to be answered.

jim

Jim, the bell housings different lengths like the FE truck vs car transmissions also aren't they?

[SLICKCOLLECTOR]

i would use a large in/out toploader. any big block ford came with those. a short or a long tailshaft will work. a 429/460 bellhousing is expensive for a toploader however. any 460/429 starter will work depending on what you use for exhaust. headers or factory 460 exhaust from a later model pickup. depends on your front suspension modification if any. lots of questions to be answered.<br abp="292"><br abp="293">jim

Jim, the bell housings different lengths like the FE truck vs car transmissions also aren't they?

yes they are. the truck bells are plentiful but the car bellhousing are expensive. they are scarce as they would have been a cobrajet or SCJ parts as delivered from the factory. or fitting a boss 9. very expensive. even more so than the 66 to 69 fe car bellhousing. FE's 250-500 range 385 series 500 up.

jim

[Roger Carter]

The top loader should have a tin tag riveted to the side of the case. Several letters and numbers, usually in a couple rows. The important sequence will be something like "RUG AD". With this number you can identify what the trans originally came from, i.e. '66 289 4v Mustang, '69 428 CJ Torino, etc.

In the Portland, Oregon area the prices you have been quoted would be for the typical small input, small output top loader. I would figure to double those numbers for a ready to go big input big output trans. And that most likely wouldn't include shift linkage.

A close ratio will work well with a steep rear end ratio and a lighter rig. Use a wide ratio for a heavier rig and/or more freeway friendly rear gears.

Will a small block trans work? Yes, at least for a while, depending on how you drive it. For a Saturday night cruiser that doesn't "work" during the week and never sees a burnout or a dragstrip a small block trans would be fine and should last the life of the truck. But then, what's the use of having a 429 in front of it?? Go with the big input big output and you won't have any regrets.

As mentioned previously, there are differences in input shaft length between the big block and small block transmissions. IIRC the small block was the longer of the two, and the difficulties of getting a big block car bell housing have already been addressed.

You will need driveshaft modifications regardless whether you go with the long or short tail shaft version. I would pay more attention to where the shifter mounts (front, mid or rear) and how that will work with your front seat. A long tail shaft version with the far rear shifter mount will put the shifter through the stock bench seat, even with the seat all the way back. Trust me on this

Hope this is helpful.
Good luck.

[LM14]

Everything you wanted to know about a top loader.

I gave $1250 for a nearly fresh RUG-AE with an SFI certified flywheel and clutch that had around 1000 miles on the whole setup. Also got a bell for a small block, the throw out bearing and a Hurst Competition Plus shifter in the deal. I went with a Lakewood scattershield behind my 351C in my Pro Stock tribute car. Deals are out there. Mine came form a guy going to an automatic because of a bad knee.

http://www.mustangtek.com/transmission/ ... sions.html

Spark

[Hubcap08]

So I need a big block toploader. It will see some burnouts, thrashing, and some amateur drag racing, It's going to be kinda pro-street gasser, some of my Dad's and Granddad's buddies race gassers, and I really like em. Swapping out the D44 rear for a 9in, going to run 4.10gears that I'm taking out of my Early Bronco since I'm putting 4.88's in it. I'm not a lick worried about freeway running. Close ratio sounds good for racing. Bellhousing are expensive, and I've seen the carnage from a flywheel coming thru the firewall/floor, so Lakewood/quicktime blowproof is the only way I am willing to go. Just gotta keep my eyes open for deal. Can the input and output shafts be changed out? I know a guy who went from 4spd to Auto in a 72-73 Mustang with a 351W and thre trans is just chilling in his shop.

[orangeRcode]

More great info. I love this place.

[jamesdfo]

Seems like you have your trans choice nailed down, so now, on to the shifter:)
Thirty-odd years ago, a learned friend of mine told me about a fellow who had invented & patented a style of shifter that was so superior to the others that Hurst, Mr. Gasket & others had to "Mickey Mouse" their shifters designs so as to not infringe upon the patents. The fellow's last name was LONG (I believe his first name was Don?)
Anyways, several years back, another friend, who runs a SBC/T10 powered Nova drag car was growing tired of the problems he was having with his "brand H" shifter, and I told him the above story, so over the winter, he made some calls, and ordered up a Long Shifter. Shortly after the shifters arrival, I received an email containing pics of the new shifter mounted to his T-10 (trans out of car), with a subject line describing something to the effect of the shifter being the lovechild of a Gunsmith & a Jeweller:):) (I cleaned it up a little, this is supposed to be a "PG"forum:) lol Several seasons later, he still has nothing but good to say about his shifter!

Anyways, here's the link, the shifters are now built as part of G&G's lineup.....

http://www.gforcetransmissions.com/shifter_4speeds.asp

** Pics of aformentioned T-10 c/w long shifter can bee seen in my album.

[Hubcap08]

Shifter location really.isn't that big of a deal. I'm going to take out the bench in favor of the leather buckets from my engine donor 1970 Thunderbird.

[bruceandersson]

I do not know about the top loading 4 spds, but on the three speeds (t-86?) the input shaft can be switched out and many different ones were used for different applications. The key would be if the cases and rest of the internals were compatible. I'd get the codes off the transmission in your friends shop and do some research. Years ago I found one input shaft for the three spds that let me use it on a y-block since it was longer than most. I just had to swap out the clutch disk to the smaller 10 spline from the large spline one used with most y-block applications.

[LM14]

Priced a Long shifter lately? Hold on to your hat.

I have a Hurst Super Shifter (not the street super shifter version, the real deal) on my Maverick. They sit high and the rods are straight. Pain to put in but worth it.

I also have a Hurst Competition Plus that came out of a '48 Ford pickup with the top loader I have. If you are interested in that shifter PM me your email address and I can get you a bunch of pictures.

Here's the Super Shifter setup in my Maverick.








Here's the Competition Plus on the same tranny for reference



SPark

[didgeytrucker]

...Can the input and output shafts be changed out?...

Changing the input shaft from a small block (long and small diameter) to a big block (short and large diameter)also requires a bearing retainer swap. This retainer includes the shaft that the throwout bearing rides on. The output shaft can be swapped and requires the matching tailshaft housing. It's easier to start with the right transmission.

Tracy

[White97]

The price seems inline. I paid $350 for mine knowing it needed work, then had it rebuilt for $700 + the Hurst Comp+. Make sure you DON'T get one with a Galaxy tail shaft like I did. While it all worked, it required having the Hurst Comp+ linkage customized to work. Hurst only makes the linkage for the shorter tailshafts. But this was still my favorite upgrade, puts a smile on my face every time I drive it. Enjoy.

Great source:
http://www.davidkeetoploaders.com/