My slick is dead!!!!!

stevechaos13 · Post by **stevechaos13** » March 1, 2010, 9:43 am

Well guys, it looks like she’s toasted. If any of you remember my recent thread, I was having problems with a lack of power, and stalling, which finally lead to a total break down and tow home a week ago. When I got it home finally it was too dark to do much, so I had to wait until this last weekend. How well that went is not really a very good story.
Well, the first thing I did Sunday was to throw the battery on a charge as it was dead from my truck sitting with it’s flashers on for nearly two hours while the tow truck fought through traffic to get to it. I put a quick charge on the battery, and hooked it up, and had the wife crank it for me while I watched. She cranked and it caught on the first spin..and sounded like someone was beating on a tin shed with a baseball bat! I had her kill it almost as soon as she started it and realized that I’m screwed on this one. I got down underneath to see if I could see any damage to the block or oil pan and immediately noticed a rapid drip coming from the drivers side right behind the front crossmember. I got back to where I might have a better chance of seeing it, and it appears to be coming from the oil pan gasket..and appears to be pure antifreeze. I hoped up and checked the oil, and sure enough, it showing double what it should, as it thin as hell.
I didn’t have the tools to pull the engine, so that’s gonna have to wait.
I’m thinking my motor is toast, but I’m not even sure where to start checking. I tried to crank it one more time to try to listen to the knock again, but it ain’t happening. It makes that thunking sound like the starter is hung, so I’m thinking that it’s probably seized up.
So what I need now is advice. What all should I check to see if the motor is even salvageable. I’m thinking that because of all the water in the pan, I’ve obviously got a blown head gasket, or possibly even a cracked block, but since it won’t spin over anymore I’m thinking something internal is snapped or stuck.
I did pull the valve cover off the drivers side, since that’s the side the leak is coming from. Nothing too obviously wrong in there, except that the final rocker arm is stuck.
Advice?

36truck · Post by **36truck** » March 1, 2010, 9:50 am

Hard to say at this point but it sounds like something inside broke. Did a rod let go, piston break, cam flatten out causing other things. Sounds like a tear down is needed.

azjake · Post by **azjake** » March 1, 2010, 9:58 am

Ouch! Sorry about that. What engine is in your truck?

Jake

Ford blue blood · Post by **Ford blue blood** » March 1, 2010, 9:59 am

Pull the oil drain plug, see what comes out. Water will settle (oil floats) and run out first then the oil. If you have water could be from a couple of places. Next pull the plugs and look them over, spin the engine and look and listen. Head gasket will put water in the pan as well as in the cylinder(s), either/or both. If water comes out of one of the cylinders. pull the heads and look for damage. If non is found pull the valley cover and lastly the pan.

stevechaos13 · Post by **stevechaos13** » March 1, 2010, 10:17 am

azjake wrote:Ouch! Sorry about that. What engine is in your truck?

Jake

It’s a 429.
I pulled the number one and number 8 spark plug, and they looked pretty normal. There was some carbon on them, but no buildup or anything.

stevechaos13 · Post by **stevechaos13** » March 1, 2010, 10:20 am

Also, I’m thinking one of two factors led to this failure. I’m thinking that the exhaust backing up caused it to massively overheat, and I think it might have also had an oiling problem. When I pulled the valve cover on the drivers side, there was very little oil inside. There was a little pooled up at the bottom, but the rocker assemblies seemed pretty dry. Plus, one is stuck after all.
To whoever it was that suggested crank it, it won’t crank anymore. The starter just clunks now.

Brian Taylor · Post by **Brian Taylor** » March 1, 2010, 11:13 am

Steve if you need help with it give me a call. I can come up about anytime I will just have an ankle biter in tow. I can help with pulling the pan and checking the top end to see what happened. More if needed, just let me know if I need to bring a engien houst or large jack or whatever.
BT

stevechaos13 · Post by **stevechaos13** » March 1, 2010, 11:31 am

Brian Taylor wrote:Steve if you need help with it give me a call. I can come up about anytime I will just have an ankle biter in tow. I can help with pulling the pan and checking the top end to see what happened. More if needed, just let me know if I need to bring a engien houst or large jack or whatever.
BT

Thanks man, you’re more than welcome to come up and help lend a hand. Right now it’s still parked out by the road, but it’s about to get rolled into the back yard so I can tear down the front end. I’m really leaning towards heat being the culprit here. Especially if a backed up exhaust was the problem.
I think I’m going to remove the front clip sometime in the next couple of weeks, and start tearing everything off. I guess since she’s parked indefinitely now, it’ll give me plenty of time to get everything fixed and done right this time.
What are my chances here really? Is it possible that the block or anything major is salvageable? What COULD have happened?

quietwyatt · Post by **quietwyatt** » March 1, 2010, 11:48 am

Well, I had a similar problem a few weeks ago. The culprit was a hole in the action plus intake I bought off ebay. It leaked water into my oiling system. Luckily I caught it before it went too far. You might have a blown head gasket or something with the intake like I did. The water dripping from the front could be coming from the dipstick since the oil level is that high. If you don't find a blown gasket, definatly check that intake.
Lets hope the damage isn't too bad.
Wyatt

PFM-64f100 · Post by **PFM-64f100** » March 1, 2010, 11:53 am

What I suggest is pulling the intake and heads. Your not gonna get that oil pan off (at least I can't image how) with out pulling that engine. When you pull the heads you can see what happened. If it's a piston then you will see that. The only thing you won't see is a rod but if the piston won't go down/up like the rest it will be a thrown rod. Sorry to hear about your problems. My $.02 it's gonna be a thrown rod..

stevechaos13 · Post by **stevechaos13** » March 1, 2010, 12:17 pm

PFM-64f100 wrote:What I suggest is pulling the intake and heads. Your not gonna get that oil pan off (at least I can't image how) with out pulling that engine. When you pull the heads you can see what happened. If it's a piston then you will see that. The only thing you won't see is a rod but if the piston won't go down/up like the rest it will be a thrown rod. Sorry to hear about your problems. My $.02 it's gonna be a thrown rod..

Okay, well pulling the heads was next on my list of things to do, hadn’t thought about the intake though. I have to pull the intake to pull the heads though right? I thought about doing that yesterday, but didn’t feel like pulling it all apart until I got it moved to it’s resting place. I’ll give that a go this weekend and report back.

PFM-64f100 · Post by **PFM-64f100** » March 1, 2010, 12:49 pm

stevechaos13 wrote:
PFM-64f100 wrote:What I suggest is pulling the intake and heads. Your not gonna get that oil pan off (at least I can't image how) with out pulling that engine. When you pull the heads you can see what happened. If it's a piston then you will see that. The only thing you won't see is a rod but if the piston won't go down/up like the rest it will be a thrown rod. Sorry to hear about your problems. My $.02 it's gonna be a thrown rod..
Okay, well pulling the heads was next on my list of things to do, hadn’t thought about the intake though. I have to pull the intake to pull the heads though right? I thought about doing that yesterday, but didn’t feel like pulling it all apart until I got it moved to it’s resting place. I’ll give that a go this weekend and report back.

The intake is bolted to the heads. Maybe just maybe you could pull the heads with out the intake but it would not be worth it (in my opion). Intake gaskets are cheap plus if you don't pull the intake you won't be able to look at the cam shaft which you would need to see also (what you can see with it in the engine).

stevechaos13 · Post by **stevechaos13** » March 1, 2010, 12:57 pm

PFM-64f100 wrote:
stevechaos13 wrote:
PFM-64f100 wrote:What I suggest is pulling the intake and heads. Your not gonna get that oil pan off (at least I can't image how) with out pulling that engine. When you pull the heads you can see what happened. If it's a piston then you will see that. The only thing you won't see is a rod but if the piston won't go down/up like the rest it will be a thrown rod. Sorry to hear about your problems. My $.02 it's gonna be a thrown rod..
Okay, well pulling the heads was next on my list of things to do, hadn’t thought about the intake though. I have to pull the intake to pull the heads though right? I thought about doing that yesterday, but didn’t feel like pulling it all apart until I got it moved to it’s resting place. I’ll give that a go this weekend and report back.
The intake is bolted to the heads. Maybe just maybe you could pull the heads with out the intake but it would not be worth it (in my opion). Intake gaskets are cheap plus if you don't pull the intake you won't be able to look at the cam shaft which you would need to see also (what you can see with it in the engine).

So I’m guessing that if I threw a rod, it would more than likely have been an oiling problem after all. It didn’t throw it with much force, because I was running at a low RPM when it finally died. I do think I remember hearing a sound like something dropping as it died or maybe right before, but I can’t say for sure. If it snapped at a low RPM are my chances better that it didn’t do massive damage to the block? I mean, I’ve seen rods throw out through cylinder heads, though the sides of the block, straight through the oil pan etc, but mine doesn’t have any of that. From what I can see, the block is still in tact, but I can’t say 100%

ICEMAN6166 · Post by **ICEMAN6166** » March 1, 2010, 12:58 pm

if enough coolant gets into a cylinder while the engine is running the rod will break under strain as the coolant cannot be compressed.

if the coolant gets in while the engine is not running you wont be able to crank the engine over (hydrolocked)

jakdad · Post by **jakdad** » March 1, 2010, 1:07 pm

Not to rain on your parade, but it doesn't sound good. I would keep my eye open for a good rebuildable core. Good luck..................

stevechaos13 · Post by **stevechaos13** » March 1, 2010, 1:07 pm

ICEMAN6166 wrote:if enough coolant gets into a cylinder while the engine is running the rod will break under strain as the coolant cannot be compressed.

if the coolant gets in while the engine is not running you wont be able to crank the engine over (hydrolocked)

That rings a bell with me. Because I don't remember seeing the leak down before we cranked it, and Like I said, it cranked over just fine the first time, but was locked up after. I guess, I'll see that when I take the heads off and coolant comes pouring out...

dwbr · Post by **dwbr** » March 1, 2010, 3:39 pm

you dont need to pull the front clip to remove or even work on any part of the engine, i have the 460 block in mine and have pulled it 2 times plus installation without ever having an issue, pulling the front clip just seems like alot of extra work
________
Toyota PM specifications

Fanatic · Post by **Fanatic** » March 1, 2010, 4:52 pm

You stated that one of the valves is stuck!!!!
Is it stuck open? Could it be that the piston is hitting the valve which won't allow it to move? Take out the spark plug on the cylinder that has the stuck valve....water? pieces? The noise could have been the valve hitting the piston... Sounds like I would first pull the heads and REALLY inspect them.

Tim

blackagatha · Post by **blackagatha** » March 1, 2010, 5:05 pm

if you're looking for water in the cylinders, pull the spark plugs First, and check for water.

If you pull the head first, you WILL dump water into them and foul up your investigation.

If it were mine, I'd just yank it out, not screwing around with in truck teardown, and rip it apart. Sounds like you've got major damage, might be able to salvage the crank, few rods and pistons, and Most of the valve train, and one head.... maybe the block....

stevechaos13 · Post by **stevechaos13** » March 1, 2010, 5:12 pm

dwbr wrote:you dont need to pull the front clip to remove or even work on any part of the engine, i have the 460 block in mine and have pulled it 2 times plus installation without ever having an issue, pulling the front clip just seems like alot of extra work

I've wanted/needed to pull the front clip for awhile now. There's some bad body work on both of the front fenders from the PO, and there are a few things that I want to look at under it anyways. Patch a few holes in the firewall etc. I know it's gonna be a lot of work, but dammit, this truck was so cobbled together by the PO, and I'm tired of it bitting me in the ass and making me have to double work.
This is the last straw on this thing, and I'm going to tear it down and put everything back like it should be.
Afterall, it's going to be sitting for awhile while I try to fund a rebuild or even another engine.