Slick 60's

Ever since I got the truck on the road, the brakes have always pulled hard to the left (specifically the front left brake grabs a lot more than the front right), and I have to really be holding the wheel towards the right to keep the truck stopping straight. It's extremely unsafe and I've gotten to the point where I sometimes don't even want to drive the truck anymore because its such an annoyance and frustration to come to a stop every time. Plus it just wears me out so fast.

I don't know why I haven't posted this problem before, but I am now.

Anyways, to keep it short, I'm going to just list the facts and everything I've done to the brakes since I got the truck:

- First of all, the entire brakes system is all stock.
- Replaced all the original lines with pre-bent stainless lines. Replaced all the brake hoses as well.
- Replaced master cylinder and 4 wheel cylinders.
- Replaced 4 shoes and 4 drums.
- Replaced the front self-adjusters because I thought it might solve the problem. Replacing them did not have any noticeable effect.
- The only components of the brake system that were NOT replaced are all those linkages and hardware in the drum. None of the parts looked broken though.

I'm wondering if the problem I have is in the hydraulic system itself. Maybe I have air in the line that goes from that 4 way splitting joint to the front right brake? It's hard to believe though, since I bled the system over and over and over again, thinking that that might help. It seemed like it did for a bit, but then it came back to the way it was (pulling hard to left).

Maybe one wheel cylinder is weaker than the other for some reason like faulty parts? They were both brand new and installed at the same time...

Any help or insight would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks --Matt

are they self adjusters or plain star adjusters which must be done periodically to ensure the shoes are correctly adjusted out?

sounds to me the left side is adjusted more out than the right.both sides should barely scrape the drums when spun.

loose/misaligned suspension components can cause pulling but usually you can feel the jerk as the offending part shifts.

They are self adjusters and I've messed with adjusting them so much that I don't think they are the problem.

I read on the FTE '61-66 forums that a common problem which would cause the front brakes to grab one side or the other was that the front brake hoses got clogged full of old shit.

I remember replacing them over a year ago along with all the other parts at the same time. I can't remember if the truck always pulled like this though; in fact, I don't think it did when I first got it rolling. Maybe a lot of crap got jammed in the right side front brake hose???

Thanks for you advice though, ICEMAN. --Matt

One other thought- Up front, is it possible you have your short and long shoes mixed up?? Maybe both "shorts" on one side and both "longs" on the other or just the short and long mixed up on one side.

Without looking at one to collect my bearings I am drawing a blank but I think the long shoes go toward the front.. Hopefully someone will confirm.

Matt,
I have encountered problems where one brake drum is a different size than it's mate. Even a difference of .010" has given me grief.
I saw where you said you replaced the drums. Were they new or used? If used, were they turned?
Another thought...or two. The springs and hardware are relatively inexpensive. Why not replace them as a precaution? You might have weaker springs on one side, which would require less pressure to overcome.
Are the primary and secondary shoes in their proper location?

A parting thought.. I like to get back to basics when I encounter a problem like this. Do your homework (sounds like you have), don't assume anything, confirm, double and triple check everything, have a buddy check your work (four eyes are better than two). Mis-packaged and mis-manufactured product seems to be the norm anymore.

Hope this helps. Good luck.
Roger Carter

Out of 4 tries on brakes, I only ever got it complete right the first try once. Last time it was a bad "brand new" rotor.

Like has been said, a misadjusted brake, a missing part can cause big problems. Try comparing left & right sides and see if your missing something or they don't look the same.

You can block off one cylinder at a time and see if the system is working by spinning the tires and have someone mash the brakes. I have used a lead shot from shotgun shell to block them off. It may be placed under the flex hose. I found out on a school bus what the brake problem was by using this method and it had been in all the brake truck shops in town and no one could find out what it was. This will also let you tell if the brakes are adjusted the same by how quickly and firmly they apply. Hope this helps. This will also tell you if that right side is stopped up.

if all else fails mine pulled really bad to the left and come to find out it was the brake cables were old and swelled and not letting enough pressure to the brakes they are only like $15 at oreilys so it wouldnt be a bad deal to change them anyway

joey

Bore size on the wheel cylinders could also be a consideration... one larger than the other causing a difference in pressure.

Well joeshmoe, I replaced all three flexible hoses (2 front, 1 back) more than a year ago when I replaced everything else too.

I wonder if crud from somewhere found its way into that front right hose? Hard to believe though, since all the lines, master cylinder, and wheel cylinders were new too...

Possibly crap from the 4 way fitting?

With all that new stuff, it is odd that you're having troubles. However, just because a part is new, doesn't make it free from failure.
Pull the right drum off & have a helper press the brake pedal maybe halfway, while you keep an eye on the brake shoes. The wheel cylinder should move both shoes equally. If only one shoe moves & the other remains still, you've got a problem in that wheel cylinder.

Then put that drum back on & go look at the other side.
I bet there's a noticeable difference between the two.

I agree. Check the wheel cylinders to be sure they match and are working the same. I recently replaced all 4 cylinders on one of my 66's and the right front one was the incorrect cylinder from the parts store. It didn't even come close to fitting. The box had the right number but the cylinder was wrong. What year slick are you working on?

It's a '64 F100 2wd.

Should the numbers on the two front wheel cylinders be the same?

The right cylinder is stamped 29394c while the left cylinder is stamped 29395c. Is this correct?

Here are some pictures showing inside the brake of each side.

Passenger-side (right):


Driver-side (left):


I couldn't see anything wrong...

I was just thinking, maybe LMC Truck (I know they suck now, but I bought all these parts from them back then) sent different size flexible brake hoses by accident. Or one just got jammed full of crap. Or they sent a wrong wheel cylinder...

I don't know, but I'll go out and take a closer look later. Thanks for all your help so far! --Matt

I know you said you replaced your drums but...I had a similiar kind of problem on my 66. All stock brakes components replaced except the drums. No amount of adjusting would eliminate the pull to the right. I had the drums turned and that took care of it for mine. Maybe you got a bad drum. Try flipping sides with them to eliminate/confirm this.

Hmm, that's a good idea.

I think what I'll do is swap one part at a time, to see what effect it has on how the brakes feel before I swap another part.

Wait a minute, I have another question: Were all 4 brake drums the same? For example, could any one go on the front or back and it wouldn't matter?

Well, I'm glad to say that I found and repaired the problem.

I had never noticed before, but a couple of the shoes were all cracked up and chipped on the underside (that's why I didn't see it before, because I never looked underneath). I went and bought a complete front brake shoe set and installed them. Aftering seating them correctly, I took the truck for a spin, taking it easy on the brakes. It stopped straight as an arrow, without a peep or squeak!

Hey Matt,

That would be a Yes!
Front wheel cyls have different numbers because hoses come facing rear on both sides since Brake Lines are behind axles on both front sides. If Cyls had same # one hose would point forward, other rearward because 1 hose boss(where hose threads into cylinder) would be wrong if cylinders were typical or had the same number. Also with FoMoCo's, the even numbered parts are generally for right side applications, odd numbers for leftside applications. Or so it has been for me as long as I can recall.

I might be stupid, but all those shoes in your Pictures look like secondary type, there are no primary shoes I can see in your pics on either wheel. Also shoes appear to be using different friction material for brake linnings. Brakes are a "system". They must be equal on both sides to stop correctly & straight without grabbing. They could differ front to rear, althoh I'd never do that on any vehicle of mine.

Primary shoes go on facing Fwd & they usually have less friction material area than secondary shoes, also to prevent grabbing on pedal application.

Did I read you purchased them at LMC as a "Set" for your truck ? If so you ought to talk to them about it. That's neglegence if they sold them to you all 4 shoes exactly the same. You know full well the reason why now that you straightened it out, on your own, at your expense, before your got hurt or killed.

Hey just my


FBp

Hey thanks for all the info pete!

You are correct that all 4 shoes were of the long type (from the set that LMC sent). No wonder I was having so many problems, considering that along with the fact that a couple of the shoes' lining was cracked to hell. Man, LMC really sucks the big one.

The new set I bought from Advance Auto were the correct ones, which installed better, were cheaper, and didn't make any stopping problems or noises!