can't get my truck to start

[mac]

hmm. could i just flip the wires on the coil and see what happens? haha

it would rev up decent and run smooth held at 2,000 rpm and if you let off quick it would break up and very lightly backfire and return to the lopey, uneven idle.

[Toyz]

Check that the wire going from coil to distributor is on the - terminal; if not just reverse the wires. Reversed polarity "could" cause the current malfunctions. Because of the sinister workings of Ford distributors, I am still inclined toward an ignition problem, although fuel can't be ruled out "by forum"!
In the old days, we would just put it on a "scope" and determine what is happening with the ignition.
It may be worthwhile to re-check all the items suggested to insure nothing has been missed, or changed since setting.
Paul

[unibody madness]

Poor grounding caused a similar problem on mine
Physically remove the battery to engine ground strap, and the body to block ground strap, clean until metal is bare, re-attach.If nothing else you have eliminated a potential problem.
John

[mac]

wire from coil to distributor is indeed on the negative side. i rechecked the points gap and it is right around .017. it caught muliptle times today but would die no matter what after 30-45 seconds. as if there was no more spark or fuel. and then all of the sudden my starter stopped engaging, it doesn't turn the engine over at all. i guess i just bought a starter

[longcabjohn]

I would suggest you hire someone. It is easy to see you are in over your head and if you keep trying you are going to make it harder in the end. I hate to be so blunt, but I think it needs to be said.



Johnny

[Gary Seymour]

I would do a rough check of the timing chain/gear condition by removing the dist. cap and turning crank slightly back and forth with a socket and ratchet. Watch the rotor as you move the crank. If it does not turn right away with the crank rotation, then the timing chain and gears are N/G.

[64crew4x4]

Mac...may I ask how old you are..?

I had my First 64 Ford 1/2 ton given to me on my 17th B-day by my Dad....It was a 292 4 speed truck as well....

I loved that truck to Death....

I feel your frustration....these guys are all trying their best to help you out here, as we All love to see these trucks Running...

My suggestion to you
1. Get a Book that Fully covers your truck and READ it....An older Chiltons can be found at a Good Library and copies made...
2. Keep it simple....the Plus side of these trucks is they are SUPER SIMPLE to work on, but you must have a basic understanding of mechanics...
3. DO not Get overly frustrated....in frustration you tend to over look the simplest things....

Tell us the History you have with this truck...what have you done to it..? how long you had it..? did you get it this way..?

Here is how I would aproach it....

Start with the Disty again....Pull it CLEAR out of the truck....verify the shaft under it is in good shape going into your oil Pump....if you do not know about it, READ up on it..it is very important as well....
With the Disty out, roll the truck over to TDC#1 and then install the disty back in....this can be a bit tricky but is worth it to KNOW without a doubt that you have it home and on center to #1....If you can afford a Pertronics Solid state unit for your disty, buy one...it will be a worthy investment... Once you have established that your Disty is Happy and at TDC1 Start adding wires back to it one at a time in the firing order they should be....

Once you have that done....For curiousity sake while you are doing those Valve cover gaskets, check and verify that all your Valve train is Gapped correctly....You will want to read up on this as well.....If you have Fuel and Fire, and you are timed even close to correctly these old Y blocks pop right off and purr....Fire thru the carb Means an intake valve is part way open while a cylinder is firing....??? That means one of 2 things....valves are out of adjustment, or timing is Way off...

Lastly....you say you rebuilt the carb....? so you had it off the motor.... check to be sure you did not pull or pinch a wire in that process....look around at the base of the carb to see if any wires are laying tight to it or not...and verify they are all in good shape with no bare wire showing....

to give you a bit of insite...at 17 I got this truck and it was Contruction Orange...it was a retired Hwy truck....I could not be seen in such a thing going to my Senior Year of High school....So I immediately went out and found a Teal and White Custom Cab with all its Chrome that had been totally gutted...No motor , no tranny, no interior, no Wiring, no Dash...paid 50.00 for it....I then took 3 weeks of my Summer to swap everything out of the Orange truck over to it..much to the Mismay of my Dad....All that time he would not lift a finger to help me...As he was a bit upset... at the end of that 3 wks, I had power, and it would Crank all day long, but no fire....so after another 3 wks of No truck and total utter frustration ....I finally begged him to help me chase the problem down....So he made me walk him thru everything I had done...and I finally figured out I had 2 single lil wires backwards....I was Pissed and Happy all at the same time....and I had actually figured it out, after cooling off, and stepping back for a few days...

Sorry for the long Rant, Hope it helps you....Good Luck, and let us know when you get her happy....

[mac]

I would suggest you hire someone. It is easy to see you are in over your head and if you keep trying you are going to make it harder in the end. I hate to be so blunt, but I think it needs to be said.



Johnny

obviously i am not a professional old truck restorer. but i've always worked on cars and trucks. i am 22 and have never owned anything this old, or anything with a carburetor or distributor, i've never had to static time an engine. i went from a truck that would not even start, to a truck that would shoot flames out of the carb to a truck that ran the other day. now the starter went, which is my fault but i don't think i'm in over my head.

64crew4x4- i got the truck in late november. it ran well enough to get it home and i drove it around town a few times but it had horrible cold starting issues and would die if you tried to accelerate or go up a hill (classic bad accelerator pump symptoms) so i ordered the carb rebuild kit and got everything for an ignition tune up for christmas. did the carb, plugs, wires, dis. cap, rotor, condensor, points, coil, coil condensor. the truck has some pretty half assed wiring that's been done. when i started doing the ignition system i realized the firing order was wrong and from there it went downhill trying to figure out what was going on. after a few trys i got the engine timed well enough to idle the other day. although i've always worked on vehicles i haven't done most of this stuff so i'm learning as i go and appreciate the input and patience.

[unibody madness]

Think of all the things you are learning and knowledge you will one day be passing on. Right now my 24 year old son is trying to get one of four vehicles running right and feeling the same frustration. I try and help him with the knowledge I aquired when I was 24. You might not think so but you are learning by the day.
Just a little question though, when you are at top dead center and pointing at the number one wire. can you spin both of your valve push rods? If so, and the pink wire under your dash has been replaced, and the ignition switch has been replaced, and your grounds checked, Check the wire that the pink wire feeds into, in the loom. It exits about center of the engine bay and should be joined by a brown wire on the loom side, That runs to the selenoid and provides the constant 12 volts discussed earlier during starting. These wires are often cracked and brittle, and should be replaced.
John

[Toyz]

As you know at this point, multiple courses of action can mask the original problem, or, add an extra one!
This is just my opinion, but take it for whatever it may be worth. DON'T remove anything without having a good reason to think it is suspect. You can check the distributor as mentioned previously without removing it; just bump the distributor cam up to where the points are open, in the same manner as if you were to gap them. Then with the rotor in place ,"rock" the shaft and watch for point movement. If it is enough to close the points, then the distributor needs replacement. If not, and the points are making and breaking fairly evenly, leave it alone. Toss a new condenser in there (the one mounted on the point (advance) plate and make sure it is tightened securely with the correct screw. It would not be the first time a new condenser has failed. Remove the distributor hold-down bolt and bracket, clean both thoroughly , sand the bracket and distributor points of contact. This will help assure a good ground; reinstall bracket and tighten. Check the ground from engine to cab, and battery to engine. It wouldn't hurt to take a set of jumper cables and run the - cable from battery - to the engine block temporarily.
I am still not understanding the jumper wire situation you mentioned; it still makes no sense to me. All this should have done was duplicated the wire John mentioned which runs from starter relay terminal "I" , and is only energized during starting. It will not provide constant 12 volts under those conditions, it will provide just slightly less than available battery voltage with starter engaged.
If your carburetor is providing fuel without visible flooding, it should be sufficient to start a choked cold engine.
As you stated, you got it to run; now it's just a matter of attacking the weaknesses.
Pat's suggestion also has much merit; if you have someone available to pull you, this will remove the load from the starter while allowing optimum voltage even through the resistor wire. As he stated, it also allows you to exceed the engine rpm provided by the starter. It would just be a little harder to get to any resultant carburetor fire. For that reason, I would suggest doing this with the air cleaner installed!
Paul

[mac]

-as far as being able to spin pushrods? what would that prove? would it be worth taking a newly gasketed valve cover off?
-going to check into that red/green resistor wire...does anyone know the part number?
-i will check the distributor for play and clean it up.
-i replaced battery/engine ground, and will replace engine/cab and starter/frame
-carb fire is a non isssue at this point, i think the carb is performing fine and timing is very close
-could you imagine the eviction letter i would get if i tried to tow start an f100 in my apartment complex
-starter is spinning free currently, i guess it is shot?

[Toyz]

I wouldn't worry as to the pushrods, as long as "rocking' the crank pulley showed little slack.
The resistor wire, although part of the red/green circuit, is pink. I would have to check for part #. The replacement is spliced/ soldered into the original r/g circuit under the dash, at each end of the old wire.
You mentioned an "external condenser" ; if the one you replaced is at the coil, go ahead and re-replace the one in the distributor. Might even dis-connect the radio suspression one at the coil for now, just in case!
Just tell the apt. manager it's a "jumper cable"
Starter DRIVE sounds like what's damaged, probably just as well to replace the assembly. Just make sure the one they provide is complete with drive installed!
Again, good luck!
Paul

[mac]

oh i was under the impression that the red/green wire was the resistor itself because it was very long and coiled up under the hood. so the actual resistor is under the dash.

i'll try a new condensor, that is after i get a starter i read the y block starters were really tough to manuver out, is that more an issue on t-birds and fairlanes and such?

...i owe you a 6 pack for all this tech support paul, my name is dan by the way

[Toyz]

Dan, it takes a little juggling when compared with "modern" starters, but it is not too difficult.
Happy to help, and hoping for success!
Thanks,
Paul

[mac]

got a new starter and drive gear coming from napa, but the gear installed on the starter, what's involved with that? i hope it's reletivley simple

[Toyz]

Pretty straight forward. There are several different types, but the starter drive should come with instructions and new retaining parts. If any questions arise, just let me know the original brand of starter, or the part number of the replacement.
Paul

[mac]

got the starter and drive. i can go out and get pics or a part number if you need it but basically the drive comes with a pin that goes through the shaft on the starter, but it doesn't just slide in. there's gotta be a trick.

[Toyz]

Sounds like an Autolite with "FOLO THRU" starter drive; should be able to line up the pin holes, slip the drive in place, then compress the spring and fllower washer enough to insert the pin, which will be covered by the washer when you release the spring, thus holding the pin in place.
Paul

[mac]

exactly. guys on a 9n tractor forum used a c-clamp to compress it so i'm going to try that. the old starter is out. the drive cracked and sprung apart but looks like no pieces are in the bell housing. my question is: who at Ford thought it was a good idea to put that top bolt where it is? i went through a bunch of ratchet extension combos to finally get it.

[mac]

no luck with a c-clamp or vice in compressing anything enough to get a pin in. i don't see how people are doing this. i've found stuff on google but it's never quite the right drive gear or info. might have to find a shop with knowledge on the subject. or an old farmer trick.

i returned the bendix and a replacement comes tomorrow. it was in the start or 'engaged' position and i could not force it to disengage. so hopefully the new one comes in the disengaged position. and who knows, maybe that's why i couldn't compress it enough to start the pin.